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 Post subject: General advice for a newbie in a Nethercott IC
PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 10:44 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:57 pm
Posts: 36
Hi all, just some basic questions really, after being new to canoes this year and having spent a couple of months in the boat now im planning my updates to the boat before the training weekend/nationals, any advice would be much apprieciated, and maybe let a few people know there are some keen newcomers?

The dancefloor: currently has pads of progrip stuck onto 2k paint. so grippy bits with slippy bits in between, which has lead to simply falling off in more windy conditions. are people using large sheets of progrip to cover the whole area Contender style? or just painting the area with something like International Interdeck? guess the latter would be cheaper and wouldnt peal off after a couple of sails?

tacking: Ive got myself into a bit of a bad routine possibly here, in the lighter winds esp im sliding the seat over after the boat has come back into the wind. This seams to work for me up untill a blow maybe F3 and up, above which im just struggling to get the boat through the wind without it falling over, usually to windward on the origional tack. There is another canoe at my club a Razorback AC which races occasionally and he has his mainsheet mounted on the front of the seat carriage. this seames to make sence but obviously there is an issue with the sheeting angle on the boom, any thoghts on this? (im tacking standing up/running around the back). Is there anybody who has the mainsheet on the front of the carriage? and is my pulling the seat out after the tack just wrong and i need to get out of the habbit asap?

Trim: At first i found that the carriage shuffles backwards ending up around the middle of the tracks due to the angle of the mainsheet to the boom and had to kick it forward turing tacks. A couple of weekends ago in a nice F3 which had me leading the allcomers fleet of 30 and coming 2,3,4 on handicap i found on a gusty tight reach that i was nosediving quite dramatically, so after that i installed a 2:1 sytem for pulling aft and another for moving forward, after one race i ditched the forward system but still have the aft system with the idea that if i come off a windward mark in wind im unlikely to be able to get to the centre of the boat to pull the carriage aft but may be able to grab the control line and at least yank myself aft a bit. however last weekend in a F4 with gusts F5+ (in which i had absolutely no control of the boat and was beaten to every mark of the one lap i managed by a solo :( ) with the carriage right aft i was still having a major nosediving issue, eventually resulting in an almost full cartwheel at the end of the seat and fully aft. Is this possibly to do with my rig settup or is it just me being a novice and well above my technique level?

anyway rant over! there are so many more things but ill spare you!

Chris IC 193


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 Post subject: Re: General advice for a newbie in a Nethercott IC
PostPosted: Wed May 25, 2011 4:01 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2008 12:35 am
Posts: 29
Location: norwich norfolk
Hi Chris

Have a word with "gromit" RS 400 sorry can not remember the fellows name but he used to sail an IC before he took up the 400 with his wife.
He might have some ideas that can will help you however some of your problems might just be weight on the plank.
Also have a read of this for advice on tacking.
http://www.internationalcanoe.yachting. ... 21%2F0%2F0
http://www.internationalcanoe.yachting. ... rticle.pdf.
Advice on tacking & gybeing from Lester Noble

I hope all of the above will be of help.

hope to catch up again in 3 or 4 weeks

bert


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 Post subject: Re: General advice for a newbie in a Nethercott IC
PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 1:37 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2003 7:28 pm
Posts: 228
Location: United Kingdom
Hi Chris
grip on dance floor- from what I can see most boats are different but I have had progrip over the whole area on my last boat and that worked well and so will repeat it on the next one, the only problem with it has been that it being black, in the very hot sun it has lifted, but that was in Oz so Hicklings prob a little cooler .
Tacking- I find that the timing of sliding of the the seat critical, it seems that I need to slide it across just as the nose goes through the wind, but read the articles from Anders and Lester, they both know more than me! Sheet mounting from the front of the seat is a little unusual, but I have seen a couple of boats like this, but have also found that you really need to centre the main up wind to get the best from the boat, mounting main sheet further forwards makes that harder.
nose diving, normally cured by moving seat aft, but how far does it go and is it a piarnhna hull you have? if it is then they are a bit more liable to nose diving as the later ones had the rocker flattened out in them
Hope that helps a little, I am in Norfolk as well, perhaps some time if there are enough of us here in the east we can have a open locally
Alistair

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 Post subject: Re: General advice for a newbie in a Nethercott IC
PostPosted: Thu May 26, 2011 2:22 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2005 7:45 pm
Posts: 757
Location: United Kingdom
The nice thing about throwing the plank before you tack/gybe is that the thing is out there waiting for you and already giving some stability and righting moment. Especially valuable gybing. I think the good guys get straight onto the plank in the process of tacking: sadly I'm not that good.

I too find that the last possible second before the boat goes through head to wind is the best time to throw the plank. If you're letting the boat heel a tad as a roll through the tack then gravity helps which is handy. Of course if you've got more tha a tad of heel on and the plank goes straight in the water then that's not going to go well.


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 Post subject: Re: General advice for a newbie in a Nethercott IC
PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 12:29 pm 
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Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2010 9:26 pm
Posts: 30
Sorry just on a small side note.

I would love to see a open in the east I'm based in Norfolk and Essex and sail with two other canoes in Essex.

Jon

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Jon Brooke

GBR 136 'Heretic' FOR SALE


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 Post subject: Re: General advice for a newbie in a Nethercott IC
PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 3:04 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 9:07 pm
Posts: 47
Location: United Kingdom
if this is gbr193 a glass nethercot hull and wooden deck someone must have been messing about with the rig in the past 2 years since i sold it.it never used to have a nose diving proble as ian mcferson will attest to have sailed bak with me at loch lomond europeans in the heavgy weather race. the boat should have an ally carriage and runners and should not need the seat any further back than the back of the centre board slot, it also used to have a 2 to 1 terainer for pulling the seat back and a rope arrangemet throughto the mainsheet take off on the boom to automatically move that back at the same time.
if any or all of these have been removed or replaced cant help a lot more. check the rake at the gooseneck with the back deck level there should be 6 inches of back rake.


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 Post subject: Re: General advice for a newbie in a Nethercott IC
PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2011 7:02 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2011 3:57 pm
Posts: 36
Hi Bob, yeah its that boat, havent actually measured the rake, and the boats getting a quick respray and sort out whilst i cant sail for a couple of weeks, so thats something ill check when i get it back together, its currently got an Angle Carbon mast is this how it was with you? maybe its changed and that explains soemthing? anyway i think it goes well im just being a bit wobbly when it blows. my main 'down the mine' moment that got me worrying about nosediving so much was lapping a gp14 and a Leader during a reach of the course and really just slammed into their wake and fell off! but still struggling to get it to just pop up.
also during my sort out im fitting a large sheet of progrip oer the whole back deck, seems to make sence, half of swims have been because ive slipped off the polished 2k surface. im sure the internets got this well covered but...shall i just brush on some evo stick contact adhe to the progrip and stick down to a prepped surface?

Chris


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 Post subject: Re: General advice for a newbie in a Nethercott IC
PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 12:13 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2003 7:28 pm
Posts: 228
Location: United Kingdom
I think that If you use the brush on type then the progrip tends to curl up?, I used spray on contact adhesive when I fitted mine, and will be doing the same in the next few weeks, but I will also be masking taping the progrip to a flat sheet to put the glue on to keep it flat.

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 Post subject: Re: General advice for a newbie in a Nethercott IC
PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 2:39 pm 
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Joined: Thu Sep 08, 2005 9:31 pm
Posts: 97
I have used the self-adhesive pro-grip - it sticks surprisingly well ( and without the bubbles of unstuck that brush-on evostik gets) The edges as usual need care to make sure they are well stuck, and engineered so you you don't peel up the edge.
Maybe by running over the gunwale/deck edge, so it's stuck to the topsides, and beyond where you actually need it on the deck.
Get a sheet from P & B or sailboats.co.uk or similar.
3M nonslip tape ( rubbery stuff) is also good and sticky, but a bit rough and better for trapezing gunwales etc.


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 Post subject: Re: General advice for a newbie in a Nethercott IC
PostPosted: Mon Jul 18, 2011 2:11 pm 
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Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 10:29 am
Posts: 18
Different people seem to find different tacking styles work well, just between the two other canoes locally and I, we all do it slightly differently! but if it helps, here's what I do:

From being fully hiked from the end of the seat, pick your moment and make sure you have enough space. Just before you are ready to tack, go from hiking out to sitting upright on the very end of the seat, ease the mainsheet about six inches, just enough to twist open the top of the leech, cleat it and throw it into the middle of the boat. Leaving the mainsheet cleated, steer the boat gently into the wind. As you do so, the heeling pressure on the rig will reduce, so you can simultaneously move your body weight inboard to keep the boat just slightly heeled, maybe a degree or two. Once you are far enough inboard to get off the seat, normally before you reach head to wind unless it's really blowing, stand up on the aft deck and throw the seat across. I normally do this with the boat still slightly heeled over, as it's easier to throw the seat all the way across if it's going 'downhill'- although if you are too far heeled it will hit the water on the new side and stop you from turning. once you have thrown the seat, with the boat continuing to turn through the wind, step round the back of the mainsail, swap hands with the tiller (trying not to wiggle it as you do so), and pick up the mainsheet with the new forward hand. if you have done it right and carried on steering smoothly through the tack during all of this, you should now be beginning to bear away on the new tack, and starting to heel slightly. once you feel the boat heeling over on the new tack, sit down quickly on the seat- this simultaneously brings the boat upright, pops the battens on the mainsail and gives you a burst of speed on the new tack- then sheet back in the little bit you originally let out on the main, and steer the new course.

Hope this helps!


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 Post subject: Re: General advice for a newbie in a Nethercott IC
PostPosted: Fri Nov 09, 2012 10:22 pm 
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Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 7:38 pm
Posts: 25
Location: The Netherlands
To my mind the Ultimate perfection in non skid is made by a Canadian outfit named "no skidding" i have it on outlaw and never skidded since. These guys supplied 9 out of 9 boats at the Valencia America's Cup. Available in tape, foil and paint.

As for the seat moving forward: have you tried to move the sheeting point on the boom aft? Helps too.

John
gbr 284 & 273

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The Netherlands
K-189 / GBR-273 / GBR-284


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